Altamont Swingers in Kansas

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Single Men Meeting Couples - Are Single Men Treated Un Fairly In The Lifestyle - ______________________________________________________________________________ ** "Swinging" is just a different word for "swapping" and you can't swap if you bring nothing to the table. ** ______________________________________________________________________________ NOT. Swinging is absolutely NOT about simply swapping. DON JUAN was absoltely correct. The women are NOT commodities to be traded amongst the men in the clubs and at the parties, but many of you devalue yourselves by assuming that submissive role. Swinging is about choice. Thats is why the term "lifestyle" was coined in the early 80's; it's a way of life. If a single man is not to be considered a "real" swinger, then single women should not be considered "real" swingers either. What more does a single woman have to bring to the table than a single man? Do you think that these women do not represent the same set of issues that the men do? The clubs, the parties, the events...these activities are driven by the WOMEN who particpate. The clubs will allow single women in for next to nothing for a couple of good reasons. The first of which is obvios; without a room full of hot women dressed in almost nothing, you would have a room full of nt so hot men, all standing around waiting for the woen to arrive. It would be like a middle school dance. Or a gay club full of str8 men. The second reason is even more simple. They attract MEN who spend MONEY. Single MEN and married MEN alike. The lifestyle is financed by MEN. MEN who are willing to pay TOP dollar for the chance to meet with couples in the club. And let's face it, the guys who can afford to go on a regular basis are really the ones (if you are interested in single men anyway) that you would want to meet with, unlike a towel shark from the local adult arcade. MEN who accompany their wives to the club to meet with other couples for the evening. These married men often spend (on average) $200 to $300 in a single night. WOMEN are the EYE CANDY that keeps the party going. MEN do not want to go to a party that is full of other MEN, but they want to see EYE CANDY. So they are willing to pay to do it. Mrs. Luvbugs! is a bartender, and a good one at that. She makes more part time than most degreed professionals (including me! humph!) do working full time. Why? She is very attractive. She is outgoing. She knows her stuff. She understands that SEX SELLS, and that her clients are there to see HER as much as drink a jack and coke. I have seen men sit at her bar, stare at her all night, run up a $100 tab, and leave her $30. Thats average...do that 20 to 30 times a night and what do you get? All for the privelege of being served by HER. I wouldnt do it, even if I were single. But then, I dont have to either, so who knows? THEY constitute the LION SHARE of her business, and her livelyhood. The lifestyle is not different. We need these guys at the clubs. We need them to pay for memberships on our websites. They too are the oil that lubes the machine. Sorry, but thats how it is. Luvbugs! (mR.) ;)

Swingers In Uniform - Pay your memorial day respects here. - HAving been on the sideline and reading the responses from Don I am compelled to say a thing or two. I for one do not expect anyone to kiss my ass for my having served. Yes I do admit that I worked for those paying taxes and did so freely and of my choice. See I was raised to believe that a person should get over themself and be a part of something that is for the betterment of others. I made the free and conscious decision to serve this country and its people in the service. I have served through at least five of the armed conflicts this country has been part of. Do I expect some genuflection or ass kissing no. Would I expect some respect for what I have done? No I guess I don't expect it. I do appreciate it when it happens but at the same time realize there are those who would make light of it or even as Don seems to do speak disparagingly of it. I guess I find it disconcerting that he supposed served in the Navy and still didn't come away with any greater appreciation of the sacrafices those in uniform make whether in combat or in a support role. If he wants to rant and be a legend in his own mind he is entitled to that. I am just saddened that he has so little respect for others that he would offend people and spout belittlements for people who choose to blieve in something other than themselves. To those who posted negative comments to Don I do appreciate how you can feel so angered as to bring you to want to use bodily harm to shut him up or make a post that will shut him up. At the same time I have to say it is like a phrase my grandfather used to say. "Don't try to teach a pig to sing. It only frustrates you and annoys the pic". IT is better to just ignore him and feel sorry for the small mindedness that doesn't seem to allow him to appreciate or respect others. I for one will feel sorry for him and move on. I do however wonder if Clitty and Don are actually the same person and that they seem to get great satisfaction in disrupting forums and getting people upset. LEt's ignore them and not feed their ego by reacting to them. ANd I to say God Bless America, the men and women who serve in uniform and the families of these brave men and women.

The Hunt Club of Brevard is in the news - And I thought Utah was a news hog - this subject opens a can of worms.... there is alot of heated discussions... but this is by far a favorite of mine... basically in a nut shell .. like the popos stated there wasnt anything illegal going on... just a bunch of snooty neighbors thumbing their noses because they feel they can...just because "Swinging" isnt socially accepted as of yet... i state that because of the fact as society changes and evolves more widely things are accepted... now in some states they legally recognise gay and lesbian unions, marriage as lawfull comitments as hetrosexual unions and marriages and both spouses are entitled to benifits as male female marriages so its going to be interesting to see what evolves the next 10 years.... like ive said before... who is to say what is normal and acceptable as a society... all we have is learned values and been told what is right and what is wrong... what if for the last 2000 some odd years someont told us that multiple sex partners while in comitted relationships and or marriages is normal and acceptable.. thus people would now have houses where like minded people whom only wanted to have sexual relations with their spouse would go to have fun... and indulge in what would be considered their life style and swingers might be protesting them... so who is to say what is normal and acceptable..... some pompus un informed tight spinchered duff some 2000 years ago and people started believing him and followed suit..... not to ruffle feathers but for over a century F-LDS has belived in poligamy (a whole diferent subject) but they had a good start on passing beliefs down through generations.. but when they allegedly involved minors they broke laws set forth by our forefathers and thus brought into light their beliefs... but thats a interesting mixture of church and state.. church's beliefs vs what the state says is the law....whole new subject but back on topic.... id love to open a club here for one i dont like my fuggin neighbors... and two... its intriuging... those who know us know what i mean when i say that... im working on a play room at work... that has alot of things too big for most peoples houses... but then again a new topic... but the hold up on a club here locally i dont feel there is adequate support in this area... alot of ppls in this area arent as open as sara and i... we cant get fired or ridiculed at work... then again those who know us will laugh at that one... but back one last time to the topic at hand... we need more places to open their doors to groups of like minded people to get together and have fun and not be pushed around by snooty neighbors so people realize "OUR" groups are here to stay and will be soon accepted in societys mainstream..... and be whats considered as the "NEW NORMAL"... a far cry n a hopefull wish... but as accepted ya itll happen as enough people come to light. and as a new normal maby in a few thousand years... cool... dennis and sara

How do you spot a Swinger..?! - tell tell signs of the lifestyle - just read through them not a bad idea WHITE (Novice) - These individuals are new to the Lifestyle and are still exploring whether or not they want to become involved. It is extremely important to honor their candor in identifying themselves as swing virgins. They're titillated by the idea, but one or both spouses are still unsure about actual involvement. They desire information, conversation, and possibly mentorship. Seasoned swingers are encouraged to act as gentle ambassadors. Please provide the information they seek, without actively enlisting them. It is important to remember that these individuals may ultimately decided that the Lifestyle is not right for them. PURPLE (VoyEx) - These individuals enjoy watching and being watched. Two or more couples will engage in sex acts with their own spouse or significant other while remaining visible to, and in close proximity to playmates. Many enjoy swing clubs for the atmosphere, but play only with their own spouse. Physical attraction, chemistry, and friendship are often important. PINK (Soft Swap) - Theses individuals enjoy sexual interaction with others just short of intercourse. Sexual activity is limited to flirting, heavy petting, kissing, licking, and possibly oral sex. Physical attraction, chemistry, and friendship are often important. DARK BLUE (Lowest level of Full Swap) - These individuals will engage in everything up to and including intercourse with the opposite spouse or significant other. Most have established rules regarding what is and is not acceptable. Many require that their spouse or significant other remain in the same room or at least in full view. Physical attraction, chemistry, and friendship are often important. DARK GREEN (Second level of Full Swap) - These individuals will engage in everyting up to and including intercourse with the opposite spouse or significant other. Most require their spouse or significant other to be on the permises but not necessarily in the same room. Physical attraction, chemistry, and friendship are often important. YELLOW (Third level of Full Swap) - These individuals will engage in everything up to and including intercourse with the opposite spouse or significant other. Spouses or significant others are usually required to remain on the premises but not necessarily in the same room. Physical attraction and chemistry are usually important. On-going friendship usually not important and often not even desired. RED (Forth level of Full Swap) - These individuals have an open relationship. They play alone or together. They are free to have sex with whomever they choose, whenever or wherever they please, as long as they inform their spouse or significant other. Most are okay with casual encounter and do not desire on-going friendships. BLACK (Anything Goes) - These individuals have no rules or requirements at all. They will have sex with anyone, anywhere, at any time. COBALT (Bisexual) - This individual is bisexual. The person may be male or female. He or she may be single or attached. This color simply signifies that the individual will engage in sexual activity with member of the same sex. LIGHT GREEN (Generic Wristband) - This individual is a swinger but does not wish to be indentified in any other respect. If you want to know what this person will engage in you will have to ask. Reasons for wearing a generic band vary. Sometimes the individual's swing style depends on the venue. Sometimes these individuals will move from one catagory to the other, depending on how and by whom they are approached. Some individuals simply enjoy a sense of mystery and the process of discovery, and some resent catagorization.

swingin - thought this site was a swingers site -

On a serious note... - A court case that could effect lifestylers with children - IMPORTANT COURT CASE MAY AFFECT SWINGERS WITH CHILDREN NATIONWIDE!!! URGENT NOTICE TO RESPONSIBLE PARTICIPANTS IN THE ADULT LIFESTYLE This Notice is directed to all swingers, exotic dancers, adult business owners and anyone involved in the adult industry. There is a very important legal case going on in the state of Florida which can affect everyone in the swinging and adult community nationwide who has children under the age of 18. Deltadawn who is a fairly well known member of the swinging community in the Tampa Florida area has lost her right to see her 2 1/2 year old baby girl simply due to being a swinger. Deltadawn had shared custody of her 2 1/2 year old baby girl with her "ex," who happens to be an attorney. He found out that she was in the swinging lifestyle and has filed a motion with the Hernando County Court of Florida to remove all of her parental rights, primarily on the basis of her swinger lifestyle. THE OUTCOME OF THIS CASE COULD HAVE VERY SERIOUS AND DETRIMENTAL REPERCUSSIONS FOR EVERYONE IN THE ADULT LIFESTYLE. The outcome of this case is critical and could set precedent for everyone involved in any form of the adult lifestyle nationwide. If the argument that participating in the adult lifestyle reflects adversely on parental rights, losing this case could open a Pandora's Box for lifestylers with children across the country. An adverse decision in this action could mean that anyone, gay or straight, with children could be at risk of losing their children and having their parental rights stripped away, simply because of the lifestyle that we all enjoy. Swingers and everyone in the adult entertainment industry would have to live in fear that they may be turned in and could lose their children simply because of our lifestyle choice. WINNING THIS CASE COULD HELP ESTABLISH CASE PRECEDENT AND HELP PROTECT OUR PARENTAL AND CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS Winning this case will mean loving parents do not have to live in fear that our legal system, some governmental agency, or some adversarial parent, will have the ability right to terminate your parental rights or take your children, simply because of a lifestyle choice that never involves well nurtured children. The rejection of private sexual lifestyle as a basis for terminating parental rights will set precedent that could serve to protect those in the lifestyle or in the adult entertainment business from unjustified intrusions into their personal lives. Under the U.S. Constitution we should have the right to our lifestyle choice without censure, condemnation and fear of losing our children. Deltadawn has retained Luke Lirot as her attorney in her fight to maintain her parental rights. Luke Lirot is one of the premier Constitutional and adult civil rights attorneys in the country (you can do an internet search of him to verify his credentials). He is constantly traveling all over the country defending peoples civil rights and is a true champion of justice. He is constantly in the newspaper and often appears on television nationwide. As any lawyer, he depends on his clients to provide him with a living, and Justice comes at a price. Deltadawn needs your help... We need all people involved in the swinging community and adult industry, nationwide, to reach into their pockets and contribute to her legal defense fund by donating what help they can to attorney Luke Lirot. THE OUTCOME OF THIS CASE COULD HELP US ALL Please make checks or money orders payable to: LUKE LIROT, P.A. (Please write in "Deltadawn Legal Defense Compensation" in the memo section of your check or money order) For further information, please contact: Luke Lirot Attorney and Counselor at Law 112 N. East Street, Suite B Tampa, FL 33602 (Tel) 866-387-8469 (TOLL FREE), OR 813-221-9533 (Fax) 813-221-9175 Email: [email protected] We sincerely appreciate your goodwill and support in this urgent and important matter! POST SCRIPT FROM LUKE LIROT: This legal battle is truly tough. Deltadawn's lifestyle experiences are being used as a weapon to try and take a loving child, much in need of her mother's love, away from her. To stop this effort, we must employ every possible tool at our disposal. We need the services of psychologists, social workers, and other professionals to show that Lifestyle characteristics, never revealed or foisted on any child, have no detrimental impact on children. Under Florida law, like virtually every other jurisdiction in the nation, the factors evaluated by the courts are whether parental contact "is in the best interests of the child." To do this, we need to show that participation in the Lifestyle, in and of itself, does not make anyone a bad parent. There are only a few formalities. Under Florida Law, Rule 4-1.8(f) of the Rules Regulating the Florida Bar governs "Compensation by Third Party," and allows for parties unrelated to the litigation to pay fees and costs on the clients behalf. The Rule states: Compensation by Third Party. A lawyer shall not accept compensation for representing a client from one other than the client unless: 1)The client consents after consultation; 2)There is no interference with the lawyer's independence or professional judgment or with the client/lawyer relationship; and information relating to representation of a client is protected as required by Rule 4-1.6 (confidentiality of information)." If these conditions are acceptable to you, and you care about this important case, we would welcome your help. These donations are not tax deductible, but they are evidence of true human kindness. Thank you! -Luke Lirot-

Staying a couple in the lifestyle - - [quote=Sofutosuwappu]Our experience so far: Religious > naturist > meet naturists/nudists who are swingers > soft swap > non-religious > full swap with couples same room > full swap separate room Thoughts?[/quote] Wow - what a great thread Sofutosuwappu! I just read some of these responses today. We're actually shocked! Evil - 60 couples . . . WOW! This has not been our experience at all. While we are relatively new in the LS (since 2015) and we definitely have less LS play experience than most who have commented - our experience has been very different from that described . . . both in terms of our own evolution, but also in terms of what we have personally witnessed with friends. ALL of the couples we have met in the LS are still together and in loving long-term relationships (as far as we know). Part of that may be dumb luck . . . part of it may be in the 'rules' we set for ourselves. We don't play separately . . . part of the fun is seeing your partner receive joy, pleasure, and excitement! We also specifically seek out people in Long Term relationships . . . and we have stayed away from profiles that intimated a DTF (down to fuck) kind of mind set. Not that there is anything wrong with that - we don't judge . . . just not something we have been interested in. We are attracted to beautiful relationships. As for our own evolution . . we are STILL very religious, we jumped into the LS first . . . and THEN became nudists 🤣 We have made only a slight adjustment to our play style from our first adventure, and we have no interest in becoming 'non-religious' - we have found the LS to be a continuation or advancement of our understanding of the Judeo-Christian commandment to 'Love One Another'. Maybe we just haven't been in long enough . . . maybe we are self-deluded and are secretly living a life of cognitive dissonance . . . but so far so good. One HUGE change is that when we first started in the LS . . . we thought we would want to be completely anonymous . . . going so far as to create 'fake names' etc. (I know . . . but we were still virgins . . . we feel SOME guilt about that . . . but we have subsequently repented!😉) We thought that the less people knew about us . . . the better. That changed 180 degrees within the first 6 months of our stumbling into this LS. Now . . . we only seek friends . . . who can be genuine friends . . . and if that progresses to any type of sexual exploration . . . all the better . . . but the friendship rules. I'm sure we still have a lot to figure out in this regard - but we cherish our new and longer-term friendships . . . and honestly can't wait to spend time with these people. We are missing the summer live concert venues . . . and we can't wait till the next time we meet with friends. If that makes us 'poly-amorous' . . . then consider us 'guilty as charged' - We have somehow managed to maintain significant and deep friendships with just about everyone we've played with. We don't see that changing. Hope that helps - thought it might as far as providing an alternate perspective. We love the authenticity and honesty shown to us by friends in the LS - we honestly have a hard time now maintaining vanilla relationships . . . whats the point??🤷‍♂️ Thank you all for the riveting discussion!

Meeting a Monogamous Couple - How many monogamous swingers are there? - Though we do enjoy talking with many and do exchange emails and truly would like to meet others we have pretty much been wiht just one other couple for 2 years now. I am not sure how it happened it just has. WE do think about being with others however. I guessit is more on the part of the F in the other couple. she is afraid of getting something that you cant just wash off. NO WHAT I MEAN. It just happened to be this way. We have met several others that too keep with just one other couple. We have thuoght about expanding our little group too 1 more couple one day at least. US

How close is too close - - If you have problems in your marriage, swinging is not going to fix them. I think the excitment of swinging will, perhaps, camoflage them for a short time. But in the long run if there are problems the level of trust that is required to swing -- just will not be there. But I wonder how our statistics compare to the general public? Are swinging couples getting divorced at a higher or lower rate? Comparing our swinging friends with our vanilla friends, the swingers seem far more happy with and into their mate. The scenarios and issues raised by this question, happen in and out of swinging. Remember the joke -- "my wife ran off with my best friend, and boy I am going to miss him". That is a vanilla life joke. We all need to take care to respect the intimate relationship between other swinging couples. We should all expect others to respect our relationship with our spouse. But in the end, if you trust each other enough to swing successfully, then I think the other issues of life will prove to be fairly easy to handle together.

KUTV News Story on Swingers - News - [quote=INTERESTED1TIME1]Come to the dark side of swinging! We have cookies![/quote] See now that's the attitude that pisses vanillas off...when they think we're having more fun (or ANY fun for that matter) than they are...and that we have cookies too. [em]Emo_25[/em]