What the fuck is up with us shooting at the British all the time??? I would still be shitting.
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-D-
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-D-
TR
Imagine sitting in your treestand deer hunting, suddenly a pair of A-10 Warthogs fly over or near you.
I use to hunt at the mississinewa reservoir in Indiana, and they were always flying in pairs over that area. They were stationed at Grissom Air Force Base.
Actually quite a sight.
After my divorce I moved to Corpus Christi Texas, I then worked on Naval Air Station Army Depot for a private contractor, where I repaired 8,000 gallon jp5 tankers. As part of my job, I also got or had to refuel the T-36 single prop, T-44 twin prop, MH53 blackhawk and seahawk, the CH-47 Chinook, the dolphin, falcon, and any other aircraft that needed fuel. Most was COLD fueling, but many times it was HOT fueling.
It's amazing the C-5 galaxy looks like it is barely moving yet it takes off.
Iron
Imagine sitting in your treestand deer hunting, suddenly a pair of A-10 Warthogs fly over or near you.
I use to hunt at the mississinewa reservoir in Indiana, and they were always flying in pairs over that area. They were stationed at Grissom Air Force Base.
Actually quite a sight.
After my divorce I moved to Corpus Christi Texas, I then worked on Naval Air Station Army Depot for a private contractor, where I repaired 8,000 gallon jp5 tankers. As part of my job, I also got or had to refuel the T-36 single prop, T-44 twin prop, MH53 blackhawk and seahawk, the CH-47 Chinook, the dolphin, falcon, and any other aircraft that needed fuel. Most was COLD fueling, but many times it was HOT fueling.
It's amazing the C-5 galaxy looks like it is barely moving yet it takes off.
Iron
have you ever tasted their cooking....
HighDesert, they were in the only cover shown, which was the wash. They sure as hell wouldn't stay in the same position. It appears that that open area (wash) was their Fall Back Rally Point. That little trench was the only defilade I saw, except of course the wash.
The failure was on the USAF for not checking and properly identifying targets and failure to communicate. Communication on both parts for that matter. I spent 8 years in the infantry both as a grunt and a Bradley Fighting Vehicle Crewman and I can say that the Brits did everything they should've. The USAF is under heavy fire right now for their negligence on a few occasions where British troops actually died. Here is a list of "friendly" fire (no such thing) attacks the US has committed.
<hr>
IRONHORSE360, I can drive to HILL AFB in 3 minutes. I live near the West Gate. A10's, F16's, F22's and a hold host of other aircraft fly over my house all the time. We also have a Army National Guard Aviation Unit, in the area, that has AH64's and UH60's. My wife was in that unit.
-D-
The failure was on the USAF for not checking and properly identifying targets and failure to communicate. Communication on both parts for that matter. I spent 8 years in the infantry both as a grunt and a Bradley Fighting Vehicle Crewman and I can say that the Brits did everything they should've. The USAF is under heavy fire right now for their negligence on a few occasions where British troops actually died. Here is a list of "friendly" fire (no such thing) attacks the US has committed.
<hr>
IRONHORSE360, I can drive to HILL AFB in 3 minutes. I live near the West Gate. A10's, F16's, F22's and a hold host of other aircraft fly over my house all the time. We also have a Army National Guard Aviation Unit, in the area, that has AH64's and UH60's. My wife was in that unit.
-D-
Maybe the Brits marked their position wrong or gave the wrong co-ordinates to there FAC. Just a thought.
Or could it be that we need to retrain our pilots on target aquisition? It think shit should be looked into. Granted fratricide happens in very war, but we can always improve the amount that happens.
1991
- American A-10 during Operation Desert Storm attacks British armoured personnel carriers killing nine British soldiers (the same number as were killed by enemy fire in the whole war).
1992
- USS Saratoga during a no-notice exercise that included a simulated RIM-7 launch; confusion ensued, and a sailor launched into the bridge of the Turkish destroyer Muavenet killing 5.
1994
- In the Black Hawk Incident, two U.S. Air Force F-15E Strike Eagles involved with Operation Provide Comfort shot down two U.S. Army UH-60 Black Hawks over northern Iraq, killing 29 military and civilian personnel.
2001
- American F/A-18 dropped 3 Mk-82 bombs on a friendly observation post killing six and wounding 11 at Al Udairi Range, Kuwait.
2002
- American F-16 pilot Harry Schmidt killed four Canadian soldiers and injured another 8 in the Tarnak Farm incident.
2003
- American aircraft attacked a friendly Kurdish & U.S. Special Forces convoy, killing 15. BBC translator Kamaran Abdurazaq Muhamed was killed and BBC reporter Tom Giles and World Affairs Editor John Simpson were injured. The incident was filmed. [12]
2003
- American Patriot missile shot down in error F/A-18C Block 46 Hornet 164974 of VFA-195 50 mi from Karbala, Iraq, killing the pilot.
2003
- American Patriot missile shot down a British Panavia Tornado GR.4A ZG710 'D' of 13 Squadron killing the pilot and navigator, Flight Lieutenant David Rhys Williams and Flight Lieutenant Kevin Barry Main, both from 9 Squadron
2003
- British Royal Marine Christopher Maddison killed when his river patrol boat was hit by missiles after being wrongly identified as an enemy vessel approaching a Royal Engineers checkpoint on the Al-Faw Peninsula, Iraq.[6]
2003
- 190th Fighter Squadron, Blues and Royals friendly fire incident - March 28, 2003 when a pair of American A-10s from the 190th Fighter Squadron attack four British armoured reconnaissance vehicles of the Blues and Royals, killing Lance-Corporal of Horse Matty Hull, during the invasion of Iraq.
2004
- Pat Tillman, famous American football player and friendly fire victim in Afghanistan
2005
- American soldier Mario Lozano is suspected of killing Italian intelligence officer Nicola Calipari and wounding Italian journalist Giuliana Sgrena in Baghdad. Sgrena had been kidnapped and subsequently rescued by Calipari; however, it is claimed that the car they were escaping in failed to stop at an American checkpoint, and U.S. soldiers opened fire.
2005
- American troops opened fire on a Bulgarian convoy. Junior Sergeant Gardi Gardev was killed.
2006
- Two U.S. A-10 Thunderbolt IIs strafed their own NATO forces in southern Afghanistan, killing Canadian Private Mark Anthony Graham, and seriously wounding five others when soldiers were trying to seize a Taliban stronghold along the Arghandab River. Graham was a former Canadian Olympic athlete who competed on the Canadian 4x400 Men's Relay Team at the 1992 Barcelona Olympics.
2007
- American airstrike killed eight Kurdish Iraqi soldiers. [14]
2007
-U.S. forces kill seven Afghan police officers
2007
-One of a pair USAF F-15s called in to support British ground forces in Afganistan dropped a bomb on those forces, killing three soldiers of the 1st Battalion, the Royal Anglian Regiment, and injuring two others.[7]
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendly_fire
-D-
1991
- American A-10 during Operation Desert Storm attacks British armoured personnel carriers killing nine British soldiers (the same number as were killed by enemy fire in the whole war).
1992
- USS Saratoga during a no-notice exercise that included a simulated RIM-7 launch; confusion ensued, and a sailor launched into the bridge of the Turkish destroyer Muavenet killing 5.
1994
- In the Black Hawk Incident, two U.S. Air Force F-15E Strike Eagles involved with Operation Provide Comfort shot down two U.S. Army UH-60 Black Hawks over northern Iraq, killing 29 military and civilian personnel.
2001
- American F/A-18 dropped 3 Mk-82 bombs on a friendly observation post killing six and wounding 11 at Al Udairi Range, Kuwait.
2002
- American F-16 pilot Harry Schmidt killed four Canadian soldiers and injured another 8 in the Tarnak Farm incident.
2003
- American aircraft attacked a friendly Kurdish & U.S. Special Forces convoy, killing 15. BBC translator Kamaran Abdurazaq Muhamed was killed and BBC reporter Tom Giles and World Affairs Editor John Simpson were injured. The incident was filmed. [12]
2003
- American Patriot missile shot down in error F/A-18C Block 46 Hornet 164974 of VFA-195 50 mi from Karbala, Iraq, killing the pilot.
2003
- American Patriot missile shot down a British Panavia Tornado GR.4A ZG710 'D' of 13 Squadron killing the pilot and navigator, Flight Lieutenant David Rhys Williams and Flight Lieutenant Kevin Barry Main, both from 9 Squadron
2003
- British Royal Marine Christopher Maddison killed when his river patrol boat was hit by missiles after being wrongly identified as an enemy vessel approaching a Royal Engineers checkpoint on the Al-Faw Peninsula, Iraq.[6]
2003
- 190th Fighter Squadron, Blues and Royals friendly fire incident - March 28, 2003 when a pair of American A-10s from the 190th Fighter Squadron attack four British armoured reconnaissance vehicles of the Blues and Royals, killing Lance-Corporal of Horse Matty Hull, during the invasion of Iraq.
2004
- Pat Tillman, famous American football player and friendly fire victim in Afghanistan
2005
- American soldier Mario Lozano is suspected of killing Italian intelligence officer Nicola Calipari and wounding Italian journalist Giuliana Sgrena in Baghdad. Sgrena had been kidnapped and subsequently rescued by Calipari; however, it is claimed that the car they were escaping in failed to stop at an American checkpoint, and U.S. soldiers opened fire.
2005
- American troops opened fire on a Bulgarian convoy. Junior Sergeant Gardi Gardev was killed.
2006
- Two U.S. A-10 Thunderbolt IIs strafed their own NATO forces in southern Afghanistan, killing Canadian Private Mark Anthony Graham, and seriously wounding five others when soldiers were trying to seize a Taliban stronghold along the Arghandab River. Graham was a former Canadian Olympic athlete who competed on the Canadian 4x400 Men's Relay Team at the 1992 Barcelona Olympics.
2007
- American airstrike killed eight Kurdish Iraqi soldiers. [14]
2007
-U.S. forces kill seven Afghan police officers
2007
-One of a pair USAF F-15s called in to support British ground forces in Afganistan dropped a bomb on those forces, killing three soldiers of the 1st Battalion, the Royal Anglian Regiment, and injuring two others.[7]
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendly_fire
-D-
Don dont be doggen the Air Force. LOL
Not doggin em. We have the Best Air Force in the world. I'm just saying they need to nip that shit in the bud. If you notice, not all those instances involved AF.
-D-
-D-
I know I am just messen with yah I have to back the USAF since i did my time there. LOL
Hooah and thank you for you service my brotha.
-D-
-D-
HIGHDESERT read my posts you fucking moron. I am a 14 year veteran of the U.S. Army. I support our military and I am very patriotic. I was the only motherfucker that acknowledged the troops during Christmas. I didn't see your fat old ass posting in my tribute to the troops thread. Show me a post of mine that says I am anti-military or anti-American. Don't make accusations about me that are unfounded. It's called defamation. Don't fuck with me.
Those British soldiers were sitting on the line calling air support facing the enemy. THEY FELL BACK TO THEIR RALLY POINT! Apparently, according to your assessment of the video, the only serving you did was in Canada you fuckin coward retard. You don't know shit about infantry tactics. You don't deserve the fuckin' priviledge of shining my boots, you fuckin' goat roping, pogue waste of skin. Now go back to feeding pigeons in the park you filthy old man. Now why don't you get down and do some push Gramps.
I included some threads of mine for you see, you fat frog lookin piece of shit. If you can actually read, take the time to see that you'll be eating crow...
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=5649&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=5565&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=1030&TID=group&groupid=284
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3506&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3711&TID=7&groupid=&page=1
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3691&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3676&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3234&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3161&TID=7
-D-
Those British soldiers were sitting on the line calling air support facing the enemy. THEY FELL BACK TO THEIR RALLY POINT! Apparently, according to your assessment of the video, the only serving you did was in Canada you fuckin coward retard. You don't know shit about infantry tactics. You don't deserve the fuckin' priviledge of shining my boots, you fuckin' goat roping, pogue waste of skin. Now go back to feeding pigeons in the park you filthy old man. Now why don't you get down and do some push Gramps.
I included some threads of mine for you see, you fat frog lookin piece of shit. If you can actually read, take the time to see that you'll be eating crow...
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=5649&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=5565&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=1030&TID=group&groupid=284
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3506&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3711&TID=7&groupid=&page=1
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3691&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3676&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3234&TID=7
http://www.swingular.com/post.php?action=view&PID=3161&TID=7
-D-
No, I believe I just made you out to be the fool. Now move out swiftly and draw fire, hooah.
-D-
-D-
Language is words my friend and has little to do with a person's character. I'll not loose any sleep that a dishonest bag of air is judging my character. Oh and only religious nuts believe in hell. Spare me your hypocrisy. Again, don't go away mad just go away. Perhaps next time you'll think before you attack someone personally, without provocation and based on mis/disinformation. You deserved no respect and I gave you none.
-D-
-D-
Seeing the two of you bitch about who is a real soldier and who isnt is disgusting!
I have a younger brother who retired 20yrs from the Army.
My youngest brother served as a US MARINE now dead due to a lightning strike.
They too would be disgusted with your bullshit!
I was headed to boot camp when I tore up a knee and the Navy decided to decline my entrance 1980. 4F MED from the delayed entry program.
As to what is going on over there, personally I would let it be known that I have every B52, B1, and every strike force jet available for attack, and that I am pulling our troops out of that mess, and that if any of our troups were hurt or killed in the process, ALL HELL WOULD RAIN DOWN ON THE ENTIRE COUNTRY!!!!!!! No inoccent, few survivoirs if any, and we would step in to run the oil wells... Who is next?!
I have a younger brother who retired 20yrs from the Army.
My youngest brother served as a US MARINE now dead due to a lightning strike.
They too would be disgusted with your bullshit!
I was headed to boot camp when I tore up a knee and the Navy decided to decline my entrance 1980. 4F MED from the delayed entry program.
As to what is going on over there, personally I would let it be known that I have every B52, B1, and every strike force jet available for attack, and that I am pulling our troops out of that mess, and that if any of our troups were hurt or killed in the process, ALL HELL WOULD RAIN DOWN ON THE ENTIRE COUNTRY!!!!!!! No inoccent, few survivoirs if any, and we would step in to run the oil wells... Who is next?!
(religious nuts) only have a faith that tells them, DEVIL DOGS KNOW that HELL is a part of the world we try to leave behind but is always in the front of our minds
HIGHDESERTCPL22,
I will leave you to your delusions of grandeur, small-minded stereotyping, ignorance of small unit tactics and your narcissistic drivel.
IRONHORSE,
It's called pride. I am proud of my service to this country and I'll not have some pathetic old chair-borne ranger wanna be, like HIGHDESERTCPL22, telling me what I have 14 years experience in.
-D-
I will leave you to your delusions of grandeur, small-minded stereotyping, ignorance of small unit tactics and your narcissistic drivel.
IRONHORSE,
It's called pride. I am proud of my service to this country and I'll not have some pathetic old chair-borne ranger wanna be, like HIGHDESERTCPL22, telling me what I have 14 years experience in.
-D-
I said 8 years in the infantry numb nuts. Your problem is, you only read what you want to read. You're just proving that you are a close-minded old fool. From your stereotyping the whole of Oregon to your ridiculous claim of me being anti-american because I criticized the A-10 pilots for not checking their targets. You are a moron. I thought you said you were done talking to me. Now why don't you drift back into dementia and quit bothering me grandpa. How about it, isn't it past your bedtime pops?
-D-
-D-
Hey me pee can go 4 feet out, beat that.....
Come one guys give it a rest, we all know you both support the troops, give it a rest.
Come one guys give it a rest, we all know you both support the troops, give it a rest.
HD,
If it's such an excellent idea, why start shit with me in the first place?
<hr>
Anyway, back to the topic... The A10 pilots were definetly at fault in that video. As were the A10 pilots in this video.
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In Bradley Gunnery, we were taught to indentify the target before firing upon it. We even played cards in our downtime with a deck that had vehicle recognition info on the face of them, LOL!
Am I anti-American or Anti-Military for recognizing a problem that some of our forces seem to be having? NO! There is a clear concern there. These pilots are not taking the time to establish whether the target is friend or foe. If there was ever a doubt in my mind of whether these vehicles were friendly or foe, I would <u>not</u> squeeze the trigger.
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Sadly fratricide is a fact of war. It will always happen. All we can do is try and minimize it. One way is to recognize mistakes and fix them. With the rash of blue on blue attacks, we've been having in the Middle East, it's time we re-evaluate our doctrine and implement change.
As far as the british troops in the trench, overlooking the open field (not ravine) in front of them, where the A10 fired; they fell back (rallied) to the wash below. There is no mistake. They did everything right. The wash provided defilade from the open area from wence they came.
HD, if you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see that we agreed, you just used an improper word to describe the trench. There was no "ravine" in the video.
-D-
If it's such an excellent idea, why start shit with me in the first place?
<hr>
Anyway, back to the topic... The A10 pilots were definetly at fault in that video. As were the A10 pilots in this video.
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In Bradley Gunnery, we were taught to indentify the target before firing upon it. We even played cards in our downtime with a deck that had vehicle recognition info on the face of them, LOL!
Am I anti-American or Anti-Military for recognizing a problem that some of our forces seem to be having? NO! There is a clear concern there. These pilots are not taking the time to establish whether the target is friend or foe. If there was ever a doubt in my mind of whether these vehicles were friendly or foe, I would <u>not</u> squeeze the trigger.
<script>document.write('<object type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="370" wmode="transparent" data="ht'+'tp://ww'+'w.liveleak.com/player.s'+'wf?autostart=false&token=480_1175140494"><param name="movie" value="ht'+'tp://w'+'ww.liveleak.com/player.s'+'wf?autostart=false&token=480_1175140494"><param name="wmode" value="transparent"><param name="quality" value="high"></object>')</script>
Sadly fratricide is a fact of war. It will always happen. All we can do is try and minimize it. One way is to recognize mistakes and fix them. With the rash of blue on blue attacks, we've been having in the Middle East, it's time we re-evaluate our doctrine and implement change.
As far as the british troops in the trench, overlooking the open field (not ravine) in front of them, where the A10 fired; they fell back (rallied) to the wash below. There is no mistake. They did everything right. The wash provided defilade from the open area from wence they came.
HD, if you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see that we agreed, you just used an improper word to describe the trench. There was no "ravine" in the video.
-D-
On the lighter side...
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