Swingers on Swingular - Swingers Forum

This subject may have already been brought up, if it has I apologize, I missed it.
I am having a hard time deciding where I stand on this and I'm hoping maybe you all could add a little insight.
Thanks,
~K~

do you have kids in school? are you happy with what is being taught? do you think you know what's best for your children,or that an unresponsive school board knows best.do you believe that unbiased facts should be taught or a political agenda?do you believe that children should be held back to the pace of the slowest child in the class?do you think private schooling will send your child out in the world as a functional illiterate.i think that competition makes everything better.

I agree, if public schools had some competition maybe they would hire better Teachers.
No I have never really been happy with public school, but in our area you don't have any other options.
I have read the referendum, and I cannot see where the "Anti" adds say its full of flaws and loopholes, any thoughts on that?

sure it's the anti's ox that is getting gored. just because they say there are problems and loopholes doesn't make it so. there might be but can it be worse if you have some control than it is now?

As a general rule, look at who is against it and look who is for it. The UEA is in a panic over this thing, they are all out against it. That alone makes it good in my book!

Seriously though, this takes control away from bureaucrats and gives it back to the parents. Yes, some public schools will suffer from kids being pulled out and funds being "re-directed". But in the long run this will be better, as all schools will have to be competitive and align themselves with the interest of the parents. The real problem I see is not giving people the choice of which PUBLIC school their kids can attend. But all in all, this is great, if you think your kid should be taught religion in school you can yank them from public school and put them in a denominational school. Also, if you think the liberal BS they teach is offensive to your brain, pull them and put them in some place that has your standards.

Look, this is moving away from socialism, it will scare liberals and unions because it limits their power over the people. That is good news for us regular Joes.

To be honest I haven't had much of an opinion on this subject. One I can't vote anyways and two..... well I don't see it affecting me and how I raise my kids. Yes the schools are supposed to teach them but in the end it is the parents that are responsible to make sure their kids have the proper learning. So if funds are "misdirected" somewhere else then that means I may have to step up a bit more myself. I have never liked the school systems that I have had contact with here in Utah however they are my only option for my boys at this time..... even if vouchers become available I won't have the resources to take advantage of them. I feel that is another way to further seperate society out by how much money you make. I prefere to just live as best as I can and be happy and try to teach my boys the same.

KELNTASH.

You said:
"So if funds are "misdirected" somewhere else then that means I may have to step up a bit more myself."

This is not entirely true. Lets say that the school district my daughter is in receives $10,000 per pupil from the state. I decide that I want to put my daughter in private school and receive a voucher for $3,000 dollars. That leaves $7,000 left over that is going to be given to the school district that I just removed my daughter from. In essence raising the dollar amount to pupil ratio.

Here is a link to the bill as it was adopted.
http://le.utah.gov/~2007/bills/hbillenr/hb0148.htm

Here Here DREW4U & 4SENSUALTIMES!

4SENS, true unions have their place (or had) unfortunately now they act more like bullies and intimidate (I guess pretty much all special interest lobbies fall into that category, including the NRA which I am a member). They used to be about bettering the workers conditions, but now they are becoming a cheap political tool.

And when I refer to liberals I specifically was referring to those who think socialism is a good idea, I may have not been 100% clear on that.

The UEA (or Utah Education Association) has constantly bullied the Utah legislature and even has gone so far as to ask for the same appropriation of funds for much needed text books two years in a row, they received it the first year, and the money was spent elsewhere and they had the balls to come back and ask for it again!!

I may sound like a right wing nut job with this one, but government does very little efficiently and the less government control we have in our lives the better. It scares the shit out of me anytime people talk about socialized healthcare for this very reason. Give me the greedy money grubbing capitalists any day of the week over some mind numb gov't bureaucrat administering to my benefits.

The government does seem to behave better and more efficiently when they have some private sector competition i.e. the US Postal Service.

CNKISS, your views sound left to me. LOL! Do me a favor and set aside 2 hours to watch this movie. You'll dig it. Let me know.

<script>document.write('<embed src="ht'+'tp://video.google.com/googleplayer.s'+'wf?docId=5547481422995115331&hl=en" width="591" height="443" style="width:600px; height:500px;" id="VideoPlayback" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" flashvars=""></embed>');</script>

Well, hopefully we all vote...maybe a small strike against those that want to tell us what they are going to teach and when and how. They say polls are not in our favor. I hope they are wrong.
Lar

something to think about.....a shit load of money for years in the form of campaine contributions (legalized bribery) went into getting these pukes to put this thru....from out of state...why was that? somebody stands to make some big bucks off the whole thing (new yacht on a pier?) it sure wasn't for the children of little ol utah!!! you already have a choice....always have....nobody is stopping you from putting your kids in private schools, DO IT. oh yeah, I would sure like golfing at private courses but damn I can only afford the public ones....will someone help me in the form of a voucher. It's the same principle (oh yes it is). Aren't we sick of giving the rich more goddamn tax relief. Hasn't Bush given them (the rich people) enough....maybe a voucher for the high price of gas for the SUV drivers...I'm done, vouchers do nothing more than give the ones that can afford it more tax relief, while the poor working stiffs, like most of us, still can't afford private schools, and if you can, guess what tuitions going up baby!!!!!

The last two replies were somewhat emotional responses with no facts showing how the vouchers will damage public schooling. Im curious do you have any factual data on how this law will hurt public education?

The overall message is great, the section on religion is good, albiet it has some "made up" facts as did many parts of the movie. But the part about the international banks...spot on! It is why the economy is taking a down turn right now, hang on kids we are in for a wild ride.

By devaluing the dollar, manufacturing jobs, and other service jobs that we are loosing to "outsourcing" all come back stateside bringing back power to the unions and control of the American worker. I am not quite ready to go with you on the 911 thing though, i had family there, i have different accounts than the video would like to purport.

But like I said, the overall message about control and how things are contrived to keep us under control and we are used as pawns is fantastic and nails.

LILDEVILZ, no one is forcing you to golf. They force you to go to school. I want say over where my money goes and what it does for my kids. The buffer will help some make the jump to private schools which will spread what's left to those that stay, in affect helping the public schools. It's not taking money from public schools. It's giving them money. What the fuck do you care what I do with the money allotted for my kids?

Drew, EXACTLY!

CNKISS, I am curious. What do you think is made up? I think the bible is "made up". LOL!

-D-

one more thing (and you can figure this as fact), take the kids out of the system and what will happen? will the public schools continue to get funding or will more revenue than ever go to "more important pork projects"....take the kids out and lay off teachers just because. also with the demand for private schools suddenly your 3,000 bucks will simply be SUPPLY AND DEMAND. In the paper last week they said that one of the agencies pushing this was trying to get people to vote for this by give those of you that agree with them $10.00 for every vote that they steered toward this piece of nonsense! Talk about buying a vote!!!!!

SINFULNHIM,

you wrote:

<i>"My thoughts are this. If you want control, take it. If you dont like public schools then pull your kids out and put them in a school where you believe they are getting the best education."</i>

We don't get control if we don't get to say where the money goes that is allotted for our children's "required by law" education. Again, show us how the schools will suffer. If they're keeping 70% of the money and not having to teach the kid, how are they losing? I think they should get the 30% and our kids get to take the 70%. It is the teachers job to teach! Kids can't learn in sub-standard conditions.

-D-

LILDEVILZ, prove how it hurts the schools. Show us in the math how it will adversely affect the Public Schools.

i think i already did. if you think things will change or class sizes will shrink or that money won't influence the fat cats on the hill (like it already has). why are the teachers against it? don't you think they want the best for our children? by the way anyone want some ocean front property in arizona?....vote for the next guy giving more tax breaks to big oil....lets throw some vouchers in there on the state level............goddamn this is swingular for christs sake, isn't there someone to screw?

YOUNG4MATUEINUT, Every child is due an allotment. I just want say over what that allotment gets my children. What's it to you? It doesn't adversely affect your kid. Your kid gets his public school allotment, plus part of what's left from my kids. Come on guys.

SINFULNHIM... Darlin, How will this move affect you adversely? We are simply asking to have control of money already alloted to the kids. If we elect to use the voucher, that leave an empty seat in the school with an additional $4500-$7000 chunk of money. Come on. How is your way the right way. If the current situation were working, we wouldn't be turning out all the dumb fat lazy kids we do. Americans are fat, uneducated, loud, lazy rednecks in the eyes of most of the planet. I wonder how we gave that impression.

Side note: How have you guys been? Haven't seen you guys in a long assed time. :-)

DEVIL, you've only speculated. Let's hear how your math works. Let's see some figures.

-D-

i'm not going to do your job for you, this debate has been going on for years, go to the Salt Lake Tribune archive's.....its all there and i don't care enough to spend hours doing it for you...this is swingular not the New York Times

Vote Yes on 1

The "voucher" is for tax relief for those who have children in private schools and qualify for the tax relief. Not everyone will qualify for the $3,000 level - we only qualify for $500 per student (its income based.) Its not about where the "tax" money is going - but giving those who send their kids to private school a tax break who pay property taxes - since the property taxes are where the school assessments come from. If you send your kids to private schools you are paying tuition twice - once to the school and once to the school district through your property taxes. Thus the reason for the legislation that was passed by both houses and signed into law by our Gov. earlier this year.

Most of the "Against" in this thread have been centered around "their" tax money going to pay for a child who is not their own going to a "private" school.

Does this mean that you are also against, Welfare, WIC, Unemployment, Disability, The Free Clinic, etc.?

Those are all examples of your tax dollars going to someone else. I still have yet to see how this law will harm the public education system. Other than a conspiracy theory of the cats on the hill getting big and fat and believing every thing you read and hear in the media. Have you actually read HB148 and the sister bill HB147?

And on a side not, Yes this is a swinger site centered around sex. Does that mean that we cant have an intelligent / intriguing conversation?

SIN you wrote: "Like I said, I'm against it in principle. I guess I just come from the school of " if you want it, you pay for it"

I am paying for it. As much as anyone else. My kids have money alloted to them to go to school. I want control of it. I don't want someone else dictating my child's education.

Devil, if it was there, all the opposed would be posting it on T.V. and other media. Again, what you are saying doesn't have a lot of weight unless you can back it up.

Everyone is acting like this will allow you to make a choice weather or not your kids will go to private schools or public schools. To me it seems more like they are taking my choice away and making all of us pay for people to put their kids in private schools, not from the education fund but the general fund.
it is still taxes that must be paid. there is not a bunch of free money they are deciding on what to do with. Now the people with no kids are paying double for kids in school, education fund and general fund for private schooling.

I know i am going to get bashed here but man i hate paying such high taxes on everything. Am i missing something here?

this is not raising your taxes. What does it matter to you what building the kids go to?

No where in there do I see anything about new taxes.

200 53A-1a-806. Scholarship payments.
201 (1) (a) Scholarships shall be awarded by the board subject to the availability of money
202 appropriated by the Legislature for that purpose.
203 (b) The Legislature shall annually appropriate money to the board from the General
204 Fund to make scholarship payments for all students projected to apply for scholarships.
205 (c) (i) If monies are not available to pay for all scholarships requested, the scholarships
206 shall be allocated on a random basis except that preference shall be given to students who
207 received scholarships in the previous year.
208 (ii) If monies are insufficient in a school year to pay for all the continuing scholarships:
209 (A) new scholarships may not be awarded during that school year;
210 (B) the monies available for scholarships shall be prorated among the eligible students
211 who received scholarships in the previous year; and
212 (C) the board shall request a supplemental appropriation from the Legislature to make
213 full scholarship payments as provided in Subsection (4) or (5).
214 (2) (a) Scholarships shall be awarded based upon the income of a scholarship student's
215 parents in the calendar year immediately preceding the school year for which a scholarship is
216 sought.
217 (b) (i) The board shall make rules specifying how the income of a prospective
218 scholarship student's parents shall be determined.
219 (ii) The rules shall provide that the scholarship shall be based upon parental income as
220 follows:
221 (A) if the parents are married, the income of both parents;
222 (B) if a parent is widowed, the income of the widowed parent;
223 (C) if a parent is widowed and has remarried, the income of the parent and stepparent;
224 (D) if the parents are divorced, the income of the parent with whom the scholarship
225 student resided for the greatest amount of time during the past 12 months;

226 (E) if the parents are divorced and the scholarship student resided with each parent an
227 equal amount of time, the income of the parent who provided more financial support during the
228 past 12 months;
229 (F) if the divorced parent with whom the scholarship student resided for the greatest
230 amount of time or who provided the greatest financial support has remarried, the income of the
231 parent and stepparent; and
232 (G) if the scholarship student resides with a guardian, the income of the guardian,
233 unless the guardian's income is exempt by board rule.
234 (iii) The rules shall provide that:
235 (A) if a parent filed federal or state income tax forms, income shall be based upon
236 adjusted gross income as listed on the income tax forms;
237 (B) if a parent was exempt from filing federal and state income tax forms, income shall
238 be based on income earned from work; and
239 (C) a parent shall submit documentation verifying income.
240 (3) (a) The board shall compare the income of a scholarship student's parents to the
241 maximum annual incomes listed in the income eligibility guideline as defined in Section
242 53A-1a-803 to set the scholarship amount.
243 (b) In determining scholarship amounts, the board shall use:
244 (i) the income eligibility guideline in effect for the school year immediately preceding
245 the school year for which a scholarship is sought; and
246 (ii) the scholarship student's household size as the applicable household size for the
247 purpose of determining maximum annual income under the income eligibility guideline.
248 (4) Full-year scholarships shall be awarded in the amounts shown in the following
249 table, or for the amount of tuition for a full year, whichever is less.
250 If the annual income of a scholarship
251 student's parents is: The full-year scholarship amount is:
252 Less than or equal to 100% of the
253 income eligibility guideline $3,000

254 Greater than 100% but less than or equal
255 to 125% of the income eligibility guideline $2,750
256 Greater than 125% but less than or equal to
257 150% of the income eligibility guideline $2,500
258 Greater than 150% but less than or equal to
259 175% of the income eligibility guideline $2,250
260 Greater than 175% but less than or equal to
261 200% of the income eligibility guideline $2,000
262 Greater than 200% but less than or equal to
263 225% of the income eligibility guideline $1,750
264 Greater than 225% but less than or equal to
265 250% of the income eligibility guideline $1,000
266 Greater than 250% of the income eligibility guideline $500
267 (5) The full-year scholarship amounts shown in the table in Subsection (4) apply to
268 scholarships for all grades except kindergarten. The full-year scholarship amount for
269 kindergarten shall be .55 times the amounts shown in the table in Subsection (4).
270 (6) The board shall annually increase the full-year scholarship amounts shown in the
271 table in Subsection (4) by the same percentage annual increase in the value of the weighted
272 pupil unit established in Section 53A-17a-103 .
273 (7) (a) Except as provided in Subsection (7)(b), upon review and receipt of
274 documentation that verifies a student's admission to, or continuing enrollment and attendance
275 at, a private school, the board shall make scholarship payments in four equal amounts no later
276 than September 1, November 1, February 1, and April 15 of each school year in which a
277 scholarship is in force.
278 (b) In accordance with board rule, the board shall make a scholarship payment before
279 the first quarterly payment of the school year, if a private school requires partial payment of
280 tuition before the start of the school year to reserve space for a student admitted to the school.
281 (8) A parent of a scholarship student and the student's private school shall notify the

282 board if the student does not have continuing enrollment and attendance at the private school.
283 (9) Before scholarship payments are made, the board shall cross-check enrollment lists
284 of scholarship students, school districts, and youth in custody to ensure that scholarship
285 payments are not erroneously made.
286 (10) (a) Scholarship payments shall be made by the board by individual warrant made
287 payable to the student's parent and mailed by the board to the private school. The parent shall
288 restrictively endorse the warrant to the private school for deposit into the account of the private
289 school.
290 (b) A person, on behalf of a private school, may not accept a power of attorney from a
291 parent to sign a warrant referred to in Subsection (10)(a), and a parent of a scholarship student
292 may not give a power of attorney designating a person, on behalf of a private school, as the
293 parent's attorney in fact.

OREO'&MILK OOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHH YES

KITTY,

Is that a double stuffed oreo?

This affects nothing. People shouldn't take the forum so seriously. There is an idiot in another thread that bases his life around the forum apparently. You'll not see me putting so much into all this.

-D-

I'm voting FOR it. I want my kid to attend private schools and would love to be able to get some money to help me out. Also, I teach at a public school and if some of those kids had help attending private schools, it'd be nice cuz the classes in public schools would be smaller. Right now each 1st grade class has 30 students and it's just way too many.

Kitty,

Bravo.. straight from a teachers mouth.

DREW4YOU: Thank ya.

The way the voucher takes money away from the schools is this: You take your $3,000 voucher and go place your kid in a private school for one year and give the public school the extra $4,000. What are they going to do with the $4,000? Are they going to give the teachers a raise based off all the voucher savings (probably not seeing as how teacher

I am for any bill that puts a little more control back into the publics hands. Imagine if you had to write a check out every month for your taxes, instead of it being taken, oh sorry "deducted", from your check.

I am all for legalizing gambling or bringing the lotto here to help fund the school system but the LDS church will never allow it. If you think this gives us any control as parents you are kidding yourself and this money will not be spread back into the pool of kids like that cute little cookie commercial makes you think it will. If you go to your voting locations you can get all the facts about the referendum 1. Looking online or listening to nonfactual opinions is not the right approach. You need go and get the correct information that tells you all the details. Then make up your own mind.

Everyone does not get the $3,000 either, if you get the full benefit then that means you definitely cannot afford to pay the other $7000 to $12,000 for private school especially if you have more then one kid in school. I would rather take some of the money away from the morons who do the road construction, they are overpaid and under qualified to run such high paying jobs. I don

people like john d rockfeller and andrew carnegie, invisioned a school system that prepared children as units, teaching labor skills that are coupled with appropriate attitudes and behaviors to serve a global economic community, this alienation of our children is largely done by controlling book content, because private schools breed independent thinking they are hated by our government, so in turn all the commercials against referandom 1 are paid for by "them"
we have 4 children, they dont go top private schools because we cant afford it, and they arnt home schooled because iam happy to get them out of the house, so we utilze the charter school system which is a definate improvement over the public system.

My daughter goes to Challenger and it costs me $10,320 a year before books and uniforms and she is in 2nd grade. I wish it was $2k to $6k.

TR,
I have to agree.

Our property taxes have been raised 3 times in 3 years. Also the fees for my kids to attend PUBLIC school have risen. We have paid in, (our parents, siblings, grandparents etc. have all paid in as well) to this public school system.
Where we live the only private schools are Church schools, not really for us. I have no intention of applying for a voucher, but these are my tax dollars, why shouldn't I have a say as to which educators get MY money?
Someone tell me the last time they gave you an option? Do you get to decide who or when your taxes are spent on welfare, CHIP, WIC, etc? NO! Now they are giving you an option of how to spend your REQUIRED tax dollars and you bitch because someone who has more money than you might benefit? Give me a break, that's the most pompous ridiculous load of CRAP I ever read.
I will benefit when "Richy Rich" (Sorry!) takes his voucher and his spoiled brat out of my sons High School, makes the class smaller, makes the teacher have to be a better teacher because of the competition and leaves more than half the budget tax dollars for them to spend on my middle class Student. On new and updated equipment?
Somehow all your concerned with is that the "upper class" parents will get to put their kids in Private School? They belong there driving their Escalades and wearing their Mall Brands, looking down their noses at kids who really care about their education. Take them the hell out of my school is all I can say to them, and DUH! is all I have to say to you.
~K~

FUNLUVEN22, Perhaps you should send them elsewhere. Again, It's the national average. There are always exceptions to the rule. I know of a program in Oregon that <i>is</i> 20+ per year. It's a school of scientology. In fact, Tom Cruise's niece graduated from there. It's called the Delphian School in Sheridan, OR. Anyway, you get my point.

http://www.delphian.org

-D-

TR

well, just a few things, here are a couple of examples, I could go deeper, but wow, it would go on for days. But like I said the overall message is good. We need to go grab some beers and we could very likely talk for days.

Like the on the Christ birthdate. Most scholars put his DOB as early spring, it is a failry well known fact that christmas and the birth of christ was celebrated on december 25th to match up with more popular (at the time) pagan celebrations and NOT becuase that was his supposed DOB. (disclaimer i still agree religion has a corner on the bullshit market)

911-They discount any eyewitness that goes against their hypothesis that it was an inside job. INcluding the guys who DID see a plane going towards the Pentagon(and there are a ton of them, two of my relatives and two of my friends who were in NY at the time. The had a 9am appt on the 50th floor of the WTC that morning. thanks god they were running late.). They never talk about true physics or have a real sit down with a demolition expert who would state that you bring buildings down from the bottom up not the top down and that the collapse was consistant with a pancaking of heavy concrete floors one after another. They don't talk about the fact that the Bin Laden family that the Bushes (and may other prominent American families and companies) do business with have long sice disowned Osama, they want it to look bad so they don't give the full story. (a little Michael Moore technique there eh)

The whole gold seizure was very misleading, I think most people would assume from the tape that it was just taken, it was not, it was cashed out at a little over 20 bucks per ounce. pretty much the value at the time. and people could still hold up to $100 per person worth of gold (that would be the equivilant of almost $5000.00 today). It was still a bullshit manuever, don't get me wrong, but the video mislead, again....gotta have the full story.

So what is my point, it is biased, they don't want to give you the full story, nobody does, then you might figure shit out on your own.......now that is scary.

My point is, everything is perspective, and the thing that religion, government, science and even the makers of this video want, is you to fear something, anything. It is how they make their money and keep their power. These consipicay theorists use fear to make a living, if it was not sensational, nobody would buy their books or come to their lectures. They always use is fear to keep people in control. Fear of losing your house makes you go to work. Fear of losing your job makes you tolerate shit you would never put up with under any other circumstance. Think about the whole global warming debate, scientists are so vested in the fact that global warming is man made, and there is soo much money in science trying to figure out ways to fix it that they cannot look at any other possibilites. And like other science sacred cows, people who disagree are made to look like heretics and imbeciles, like Galileo's of our time.

Only a man without fear is truly free, everyone else is a slave to something.

Christianity <u>is</u> just a bastardized form of another religion that is far older. The similarities between the bible and the zodiac are compelling to say the least.

Regarding 9/11 The focus of the film was not the WTC "Terroism Hoax", but just a highlight. Why reinvent the wheel? You wrote:

<i>"They never talk about true physics or have a real sit down with a demolition expert who would state that you bring buildings down from the bottom up not the top down and that the collapse was consistant with a pancaking of heavy concrete floors one after another. They don't talk about the fact that the Bin Laden family that the Bushes (and may other prominent American families and companies) do business with have long sice disowned Osama, they want it to look bad so they don't give the full story. (a little Michael Moore technique there eh) "</i>

Your "experts" and "witnesses" have already been interviewed in movies such as "Loose Change" as seen below and Fahrenheit 911 by Michael Moore.

<script>document.write('<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="ht'+'tp://w'+'ww.

"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="ht'+'tp://w'+'ww.

" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>');</script>

Would also like to say that a family saying that it has "disowned" someone is just that someone saying it. Hearsay is hardly a counter.

You also wrote:

<i>"These consipicay theorists use fear to make a living, if it was not sensational, nobody would buy their books or come to their lectures. They always use is fear to keep people in control. Fear of losing your house makes you go to work. Fear of losing your job makes you tolerate shit you would never put up with under any other circumstance. Think about the whole global warming debate, scientists are so vested in the fact that global warming is man made, and there is soo much money in science trying to figure out ways to fix it that they cannot look at any other possibilites. And like other science sacred cows, people who disagree are made to look like heretics and imbeciles, like Galileo's of our time."</i>

Everything you said applies to what you are currently being told by the education system, media and government. Fear tatics were used to get us in Iraq. This can be proven in every war we've been in, where we've been force-fed hate propaganda. Hell, Roosevelt knew about Pearl Harbor before it happened. Go to any other country on Earth and you will find that their history books teach a different lesson.

-D-

P.S. Do me a favor and reply to this in a new thread in the "Free Thinkers" Group. It's off topic here. I should not have posted those movies here. Anyway.... LOL!

All I have to say is that I have a tax of more then $3000 a year from my State Tax on my home for the Ogden & Weber county school district and I HAVE NO KIDS!
Now if I were to have children and I pay that high of TAX I would want to let them go where I feel they were to receive the best education.

I also feel if I wanted to help out one of my needy nephews or neices, I should get the oppritunity to get a voucher and have them apply it to their name and or combine it with their parents voucher for that child.

I do not think this is for the rich or well off, it is for the people who want to better their childrens life, and for the ones who say leave well enough alone and go pay for it yourself, guess what, we already do, many times over and over again and still have NO CHILDREN!

Heres an Idea, how about the state give me back my money that I put in to the schools since I HAVE NO CHILDREN, that sounds fair!

My $.02.................

Wayne & Stephanie

I dunno about which to vote for - I'd rather pay for better education than anything else.

That wouldn't be in the public school system.

lol, yeah. best education I got was in college. some of it was even the kind that made me say, "WTF? why didn't they teach this in HS?!"

like for example, health. Outside of college education, how many do you think actually know the number of bones in the spine? or how many basic tissues there is in the body?

or even the basic understanding of the law?

Swingers Forum - Referendum 1