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Is this one of your rules? What is it? is it fear? or something - Does everyone feel this way? - CLASSY: Good topic! :) Neither Siren nor myself have set any specific rules about time parameters being met before we'll play with a couple, but as always with many things in life...our playing has it's dynamics and nuances, which are always evolving. So, to respond to a few of the questions you posed: Fear of STD's? Not specifically. Fear of thinking of ourselves as sluts? Absolutely not. Sometimes sluthood is fun! Fear of others thinking we are sluts? We don't and have never given a patoot about what others think of us. Values, morals? No way! We are "swingers" after all, and besides...we've both spent our time in an organized "forum" (former mormons), worrying about whether or not we were being "worthy" or if Jesus was happy with us; we're sooo done with that! Do we have to BBQ before we'll fuck someone? What's the point of that? Besides...sometimes through the interaction of a BBQ you realize, "I really don't wanna boink this person." If our kids have played together? Nah...children fall outside of the spectrum of the specific lifestyle. They're part of the social nature when we're not swinging with those that we have met during the course of our experiences. It's all good. Is random sex scary? Well, yes it is...or it CAN be...but especially if you don't practice wisdom and are not reasonable by indulging in indiscriminate sex with EVERYONE you come across. There are some seriously scary-ass people out there! This question is along the same lines as the first question of fear of STD's. Taboo? Well, hell...yes it is...and I believe that is part of the intrigue; part of the whole mind-game of swinging. Bottom line: Siren and I have been known to play on first dates, and we've been known to wait a long time, and as can be expected have had a grab-bag of results. We never carry an agenda or ulterior motives (expectations) when we socialize or meet people. We can draw no conclusion using the good vs. bad experiences and if they were a first-time play or not. We do, however, go with how we feel at any given moment and at any given event. You know...sometimes it just feels right and sometimes, the Mo-Jo is simply not there. ~J~

That little nudge many of us need - - We think honesty is the best way to be. If she found out about the meeting without her knowledge, your tryst into the lifestyle may be over. Plus, she might feel the pressure to play at some point anyway. Also, she will always wonder if the next meeting is arranged without her knowledge. Evildoers is correct in meeting with zero chance of playtime. Take their advice. She will feel more relaxed and could enjoy herself with the pressure off. We will take it a step further: Step 1: Set up a date with ZERO playtime opportunity and let the other couple know that. Do something fun (a hike, Topgolf, etc) and get to know them. At the conclusion of the date, let them know that if they do not receive a message from YOU within 24 hours, you don't feel you are a match. Step 2: If you send a message to meet again, let them know your intent and your boundaries. For example, (kissing ok), (fondling ok), (bi kissing ok), (same room, separate room, either room ok), (nudity ok or not). But, speak honestly with each other about this. It's not nice to lead people on after you have committed. At the conclusion of the date, let them know that if they do not receive a message from YOU within 24 hours, you are not ready to go further. Step 3: If you send a message to meet again, let them know what is acceptable. For example (full swap or soft swap), (same room, separate rooms or either ok), (kissing or no kissing), (bi play) etc. Again, you will have to be honest with yourselves if you can do this. By a third date, the other couple has invested a lot of time in you. So, be nice and don't lead them on. Enjoy the playtime. Save enough time for the afterglow sex with them relaxing, chatting, and laughing. By this point, you may have found a couple that you can see multiple times. Doing vanilla activities with them might be a bonus. They may even introduce you to their lifestyle friends too. The other option is attending a house party where play is not expected. You will be able to speak to several couple and perhaps, use the process above. Or you can play that night. When we entered the lifestyle, we never had that couple who could mentor us. After we considered ourselves as no longer newbies, we became the newbie "whisperers" to offer what we never had. However, we've gotten away from newbies since our circle is with experienced swingers now. But with covid, we would date newbies again.

Are we really as judgmental as vanilla people? - - It strikes me that, [i][b]in general[/b][/i], people fall into one of two groups: A. Those interested in the total social experience the lifestyle offers (multi-faceted). B. Those interested primarily in sex (very goal-specific). The number of people in group B is considerable. 'B' folks are much more likely to hold appearance and physical desirability as the only criteria for evaluating playmates. 'A' folks are more interested in the total package. I don't think it's necessarily right to fault those in group B for their limited interest in people beyond their sexual skills and desirability. How they conduct themselves is another story, however. Immaturity has been mentioned. Selfishness and poor social skills also surely come into play. Society in general continues to become more and more hooked on instant gratification, leaving little room for concern for others. This issue is reflective of society in general. Those in the lifestyle are, in fact, just a microcosm of the bigger picture, as previously pointed out. Does anyone really think swingers are any different? If anything, they are a subgroup [i][b]even more[/b][/i] into instant gratification and seeking only specifically what they want.

A quick question about Facebook groups - How do we find them? - There is a daybreak swingers group that was pretty fun...its died down lately though. I forget who the admin is on it..hopefully he will see this post and give you some more info.

Is anybody on this site for fucking real or just a bunch of tease - - It seems like there are basically two kinds of swingers. The kind that take their time, carefully read profiles and weigh whether or not they might be a good match with a given couple or individual before contacting them and eventually meeting, and the kind that seem to be more, "Hey, we're swingers and you're swingers so let's swing (fuck)." I understand the frustration that some feel when they aren't getting the results they expected or possibly even feel entitled to but as long-timers in the lifestyle we can tell you that like almost everything else in life, in swinging you get out of it what you put into it. Put in the work finding and communicating with people who interest you (and HONESTLY do a self-assessment to see if you are what THEY would likely want) and you will be more successful. DON'T put in the legwork and expect sex with others to just fall into your lap, or hit up couples that aren't in your age-range and have similar physical characteristics and interests and you probably won't be quite as successful. I think sometimes too many people use the shotgun approach of just sending out a whole bunch of friend requests or generic "We like your pics/profile." emails and are upset when they don't get much of a response. YMMV ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

We're going to SEMA! - Gonna be in Las Vegas for the weekend. Sexy swingers?? - We are here now... going home on Friday. We aren't "SEXY swingers" since we have had our AARP credentials for a few years now. We will check here from time to time. Have a great SEMA, see you there.

A&E New show about swingers... - neighbors with benefits.... - [quote=KIDSATPLAY]Why would any industry sponsor shows about the positive side of Swinging? I doubt there is any big money in promoting the swing lifestyle any more than there is profit to singing the praises of plural marriage. The vice industry might even suffer financially should swinging really catch on. This is a lifestyle that must eat the crumbs that fall from the gay lesbian table to acquire any "me to" acceptance. It seems like social and financial suicide for the deep pockets.[/quote] Naw. It's all about being able to sell advertising and a show about sex with the addition of a shock factor and ESPECIALLY one where people can watch it and smugly judge other people who are participating in it should do fairly well IMHO. [em]Emo_96[/em]

Polyamorous Couple - Seeking girlfriend for husband - I (Mr. DandDMontreal) have not had any luck finding other poly people on this site as it's predominantly frequented by swingers (great for when we want to swing!). I have had a tiny bit of luck on OKCupid and I have found a lot of poly people on fetlife.com but online dating is generally terrible for poly men. I have had pretty good luck with attending poly events like poly cocktails and the most luck just generally being open about my poly in everyday life (not an option for everyone). Checkout https://utahpoly.org/ for details on poly events.

real members? - - You've struck on an interesting topic. I call them cyber swingers. They are swinger wanna be's . They find the thought of swinging erotic and interesting but they don't have the balls to actually get involved in the lifestyle. They like to hide behind the safety of their computer screen. They'll exchange email with you as long as you're willing or dumb enough to keep writing them. They'll never actually meet you or anyone else. That would be way too personal and would force them to crawl out from behind the security of their computer. Or you ocasionally run into the single guy that has created this fictional "couple". It's all a big game for him. He's just there to collect photos or maybe trick someone into playing with him because his wifes is "unavailable " at the moment. Whatever their game they're all the same because they both violate the principles of honesty and trust that the lifestyle revolves on. We get email all the time from couples that "have read your profile--think you guys are great and want to get to know you better". That generally sends off alarm bells for us. We'll respond and exchange an email or two. If the other couple doesn't have pics posted or pics of just one of them we ask for additional photos in the first email. Since we have good pics of both of us in our profile we never send any other pics other than those posted. If we get the "don't have any pics of him or he's camera shy or don't have a camera yet" or any one of the other lame excuses we've gotten over the past year or so--that's it--you're done as far as we're concerned. We'll give out our cell phone number right away and tell them to call us or give us theirs and we'll call them. We want to speak to both of them. If we can't because one's not there we'll call back at a more convenient time when we can talk to both of them. If everything seems ok during the conversation we'll make a date to meet at a convenient restaurant or club and take things from there. This seems to work well for us. It tends to weed out the "cyber swinger" right away. John & Colleen

Looking to establish a group of safe swingers - - [quote=LUVTHEFUN]We don't like condoms. But we have heard the HPV vaccine is not recommended if you are older than 26, 30, or 45 (depending on the type of vaccine). Not sure the options, other than a small group, tested regularly, would be ideal.[/quote] It’s supposed to be less effective with older people mainly because most have been exposed to HPV in some way the older they are. HPV is the number one STI… chances are you’ve had it and never realized you did, then your body got rid of it on its own. As far as this thread goes, while it might sound ideal to have a small group of friends that are tested clean, the reality is it only takes one of those people to stray and play with someone outside of the group that’s infected with something… then they will bring it into the rest of the group. It would take a whole lot of honesty and trust to make something like that work. Can’t control other people if they decide to have sex with others outside the group… and you’d never know if they put you at risk if they decided to keep quiet. Testing in this LS is a funny thing to us. If you’re active in this LS and are playing with others that are also active, those clean STI results become useless very quickly. You would have to test after each new partner, and after waiting through an incubation period first. Couples that say they have “recent tests” are usually talking about months old tests… how many people (men or women) have they been with since the clean test result? That’s not ever mentioned in our experience… If you test on a Monday, then play with someone infected (and get what they’ve got) on a Wednesday, then get a clean result on Friday, you still have a clean result even though you’re infected. We test for our own peace of mind. Never to show others as proof… we will always only ever trust ourselves with our sexual safety, and take the risks WE can control… those risks are never at zero in this LS, and we recognize that. Oral sex has its own risks as well… Weighing risk and reward is part of it. However, leaving our sexual health in others’ hands is something we just can’t do. We don’t trust you other naughty fucking people that much 😂 So condoms always for us. To each their own.